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The S&L ‘Hive’ – Please Talk Amongst Yourselves

Here is our weekend discussion thread, where comments on the general topics of the day are very welcome.

But please remember to post and comment on specific news items in the ‘Reader Selected News’ thread below or via the ‘News Selected By Our Readers’ link found in the sidebar.

This article was posted by Steve on Friday, September 20th, 2013. Comments are currently closed.

13 Responses to “The S&L ‘Hive’ – Please Talk Amongst Yourselves”

  1. Noyzmakr says:

    There must be a suder-duper, double secret meeting of the big wheels this weekend. Everyone is missing. Maybe it’s just a coincidence, but I’m a conspiratorial sort of guy. Maybe some will grow a pair.

  2. captstubby says:

    “For Your Consideration,”
    Rod Serling

    Say No To Psychiatry – The Dangers and Harm of the Modern Sham Pseudoscience Known As Psychiatry.
    Gene Zimmer 1999

    Science, including psychiatry (which as a subject wants so very much to be accepted as a “legitimate science”) never has had anything to do with morality, ethics, decency or humanity. But it’s not “science” per se that is the problem, it’s the people who practice what’s called and considered to be “science” and the people who put into use the results of “science” that are the problem. “Science” is simply a way to observe, tabulate, and determine the behavior of things, so as to enable prediction and control of these things in the future. There is a standard way to theorize, test, and come up with models and formulas. This has worked fine on “raw matter and energy”. It hasn’t and isn’t working well on people.
    One may venture to ask just how “science” can or should even bother to deal with people and societies when it’s goal has always been to control behavior, whether this behavior be of electrons, chemicals or objects. Extrapolating this idea of “controlling behavior” to people and society results in totalitarianism and abuses. The goal of science is always to control behavior. This entire approach is completely wrong and misguided, although adhered to by almost every member of the psychiatric and psychological communities. They want to be “scientific” and accepted by the physical scientists. Why? Their aims are misguided and fundamentally wrong. It’s a stupid goal. It won’t and can’t ever “work”. It will always degrade to duress, abuse and force. If you try to “help” people by controlling their behavior, which is just exactly what any “scientific” attempt to deal with Man or society intends to do by it’s very nature, and does do in practice, it will always be at the point of a gun. It cannot and will not ever be any other way. Science, by it’s nature, attempts to understand so as to predict and control behavior. That’s what it does historically and in modern practice in physics, electronics, computer science, mechanics, etc. The actual way to “handle” people is to make better, competent, well-thinking, and responsible people, and society will take care of itself. This idea is paramount to a legitimate understanding of a correct and workable approach to bettering people, society and the world. Concentrating on “fixing society” or “erasing social problems” is so much nonsense. The only way to actually improve the “society”, which is nothing more than a group of individual people, is to first “improve” each individual person, or at least to improve enough individual people so that it makes a difference. But doing that can only involve working with and improving the abilities of the individual minds of the members of mankind – an area which is all but taboo today in these fields. The only way to “improve” a person is to “improve” their mind and mental abilities. Instead the apparently tireless social scientists come up with micromanaged notions of social control and manipulation in the form of endless social programs, belief manipulation, value adjustment, and on the other biological end, the psychiatrists come up with powerful psychoactive drugs and constant banner waving about the hope and promise of modern genetics. As usual, they continually omit and fail to ever address or deal with individual minds, as minds, as if the capabilities of minds will somehow just magically become enhanced through their social and biological manipulations. Of course it won’t ever happen, and all the belief, hope, and assertions by Nobel Prize winners to the contrary will not change that one iota. The way a legitimate science could address the area, but never has, would be to investigate and develop ways to understand and improve the functioning of any mind, so that a predictable, controlled and desirable improvement in capability, awareness, responsibility, attention and concentration could be effected. The control and prediction would be in the expansion of personal ability. Instead of viewing a person and the mind as a “sick thing” and only aiming to remove dysfunction and ailment (through drugs, shock and surgery), approach it from a viewpoint of what is good and useful about a mind or minds, and work out ways to build on and improve on that. This approach would involve the personal actions of each individual with the use of their own minds and it’s various functions – functions which still need to be delineated and investigated, such as attention,concentration, imagination, value creation, belief formation, etc., and techniques of improvement of these things developed. But instead of doing this, modern approaches concentrate on exact “outcomes” or forms of behavior and attempt to bring these about exactly and rigidly through belief manipulation, value adjustment, indoctrination, drugs, and endless social programs. They need abandon this compulsive attention on exact results, which while possible in the physical sciences, is NOT possible or even desirable with people and societies. Again, concentrate on making better people, by making better minds, and let the people themselves get on with making their own version of a better world. But the control freaks in the government,sciences, social sciences, medicine, economics, politics and psychiatry certainly abhor that idea.

  3. Mithrandir says:

    When you stop and think about it…

    Big sodas are bad for you

    Guns are bad

    Handing out the Constitution on campus is bad ( http://tinyurl.com/le9poo3 )

    Tax cuts are bad

    Home School is bad

    Speaking the truth is bad

    The American flag is bad

    Lunches brought from home are bad

    Smoking is bad

    Drinking is bad

    Driving a car is bad

    …..the democrats treat us like we are ALL on welfare!

    • GetBackJack says:

      Great list, and all true. Now think on this … who are the men and women who willingly hire on to federal, state and local services who use the threat of armed force to make you comply? What type of personality is it who sees this as a great job opportunity, never once questioning the legal validity, the Constitution or the simple decent common courtesy of … is it appropriate for an armed off-duty policeman to forcibly remove, arrest and charge a father who is asking questions about Common Core?

      Or, one of a thousand other instances ..

    • Mithrandir says:


      Right. I have always believed people who apply for jobs like police, prison guards, collection officers etc, ought to go through a rigorous psychological test to see if they really have the right temperament for such a job. Repeated every 3 years, and wash them out of the profession from 0-10 years. If they make it to ten, they get promoted, and the others fall by the wayside. Its a 1 strike and you’re out policy that makes sense.

      We have a country filled with fascist-minded people who are attracted to these jobs. Our society promotes abuse and fascism:

      ~CSI Shows: in which they intimidate, beat, harass suspects to get information (yeah, beat that dirtbag until he talks!)
      ~Judge Judy: Where a public judge gets away with crass, snotty, abusive behavior, as if that is how the public needs to be treated by our humble servants.
      ~Elimination Shows: drag contestants in front of a panel, humiliate them, make them cry, and dismiss them. Abuse is entertaining!
      ~Boxing and U.F.C.: Human dog-fighting. Who says we are no better than those barbarian Romans?
      ~Public Street Marches: Basically, it’s to walk around like little Hitlers and intimidate people with shear numbers and voices, -stir up trouble.
      ~Syria:It satisfies the public’s need to send our troops somewhere, and beat-down someone to make us feel better, and get some watchable video on the news.
      Gangs: Kids are attracted to them for the main reason of POWER. To shoot, beat, and kill others with other people helping.

      Sick society

    • Rusty Shackleford says:


      Sex with multiple partners is good

      Homo-sexuality is good

      Unprotected sex…well….guess that’s a toss-up.

      Taking drugs is good

      “Singing” (rapping) about killing cops and calling women bitches and ho’s is good

      Hating whitey is good

      Tattoos….and body piercings are oh-so-good.

      (*side note, saw an otherwise gorgeous girl the other day with tattoos and piercings all over and was actually saddened)

      Reading the koran is good

      Sharia is good

      Killing Jews is good

      Supporting communist/socialist dictators is good

      Hating yourself is good (and necessary)

    • GetBackJack says:

      .. resulting in Common Core and the 2nd Amendment bring rewritten – “The right to bear arms if you are in a state militia ..” All of which leads to black gang violence and a TSA Homeland Insecurity colonoscopy.

  4. captstubby says:

    from The One.
    please speak clearly so NSA can follow you better.
    thank you,.

    and just reminder to all Comrades;

    (December 16, 1966)

    (1) Words and actions should help to
    unite, and not divide, the people of our
    various nationalities.
    (2) They should be beneficial, and
    not harmful, to socialist transformation
    and socialist construction.
    (3) They should help to consolidate,
    and not undermine or weaken, the people’s
    democratic dictatorship.
    (4) They should help to consolidate,
    and not undermine or weaken, democratic
    (5) They should help to strengthen,
    and not discard or weaken, the leadership
    of the Communist Party.

    We must affirm anew the discipline of
    the Party, namely:
    (1)the individual is subordinate to
    the organization;
    (2)the minority is subordinate to the
    (3)the lower level is subordinate to
    the higher level; and
    (4)the entire membership is subordinate
    to the Central Committee.
    Whoever violates these articles of discipline
    disrupts Party unity.
    “The Role of the Chinese Communist
    Party in the National
    War” (October 1938)

    The Communist Party does not fear criticism
    because we are Marxists, the truth is
    on our side, and the basic masses, the
    workers and peasants, are on our side.
    Speech at the Chinese Communist
    Party’s National Conference on
    Propaganda Work (March 12,

    • Mithrandir says:

      Sounds like the democrats and our media. No comedians want to make fun of Obama, as they say it weakens him. No media wants to portray a negative storyline, no Hollywood movie inserts cuts and jabs against him, and even few Republicans have the guts to challenge him.


      (2) the minority is subordinate to the majority
      (4) the entire membership is subordinate to the Central Committee.

      So, the minority Central Committee is therefore, subordinate to the majority membership?-It would be if it were American principals of servant leadership.

      (3) the lower level is subordinate to the higher level

      This is the “catch-all” wording for a dictatorship.

    • GetBackJack says:

      Communist Goals (1963) Congressional Record–Appendix, pp. A34-A35 January 10, 1963


      Mr. HERLONG. Mr. Speaker, Mrs. Patricia Nordman of De Land, Fla., is an ardent and articulate opponent of communism, and until recently published the De Land Courier, which she dedicated to the purpose of alerting the public to the dangers of communism in America.

      At Mrs. Nordman’s request, I include in the RECORD, under unanimous consent, the following “Current Communist Goals,” which she identifies as an excerpt from “The Naked Communist,” by Cleon Skousen:

      [From “The Naked Communist,” by Cleon Skousen]

      1. U.S. acceptance of coexistence as the only alternative to atomic war.

      2. U.S. willingness to capitulate in preference to engaging in atomic war.

      3. Develop the illusion that total disarmament [by] the United States would be a demonstration of moral strength.

      4. Permit free trade between all nations regardless of Communist affiliation and regardless of whether or not items could be used for war.

      5. Extension of long-term loans to Russia and Soviet satellites.

      6. Provide American aid to all nations regardless of Communist domination.

      7. Grant recognition of Red China. Admission of Red China to the U.N.

      8. Set up East and West Germany as separate states in spite of Khrushchev’s promise in 1955 to settle the German question by free elections under supervision of the U.N.

      9. Prolong the conferences to ban atomic tests because the United States has agreed to suspend tests as long as negotiations are in progress.

      10. Allow all Soviet satellites individual representation in the U.N.

      11. Promote the U.N. as the only hope for mankind. If its charter is rewritten, demand that it be set up as a one-world government with its own independent armed forces. (Some Communist leaders believe the world can be taken over as easily by the U.N. as by Moscow. Sometimes these two centers compete with each other as they are now doing in the Congo.)

      12. Resist any attempt to outlaw the Communist Party.

      13. Do away with all loyalty oaths.

      14. Continue giving Russia access to the U.S. Patent Office.

      15. Capture one or both of the political parties in the United States.

      16. Use technical decisions of the courts to weaken basic American institutions by claiming their activities violate civil rights.

      17. Get control of the schools. Use them as transmission belts for socialism and current Communist propaganda. Soften the curriculum. Get control of teachers’ associations. Put the party line in textbooks.

      18. Gain control of all student newspapers.

      19. Use student riots to foment public protests against programs or organizations which are under Communist attack.

      20. Infiltrate the press. Get control of book-review assignments, editorial writing, policy-making positions.

      21. Gain control of key positions in radio, TV, and motion pictures.

      22. Continue discrediting American culture by degrading all forms of artistic expression. An American Communist cell was told to “eliminate all good sculpture from parks and buildings, substitute shapeless, awkward and meaningless forms.”

      23. Control art critics and directors of art museums. “Our plan is to promote ugliness, repulsive, meaningless art.”

      24. Eliminate all laws governing obscenity by calling them “censorship” and a violation of free speech and free press.

      25. Break down cultural standards of morality by promoting pornography and obscenity in books, magazines, motion pictures, radio, and TV.

      26. Present homosexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as “normal, natural, healthy.”

      27. Infiltrate the churches and replace revealed religion with “social” religion. Discredit the Bible and emphasize the need for intellectual maturity, which does not need a “religious crutch.”

      28. Eliminate prayer or any phase of religious expression in the schools on the ground that it violates the principle of “separation of church and state.”

      29. Discredit the American Constitution by calling it inadequate, old-fashioned, out of step with modern needs, a hindrance to cooperation between nations on a worldwide basis.

      30. Discredit the American Founding Fathers. Present them as selfish aristocrats who had no concern for the “common man.”

      31. Belittle all forms of American culture and discourage the teaching of American history on the ground that it was only a minor part of the “big picture.” Give more emphasis to Russian history since the Communists took over.

      32. Support any socialist movement to give centralized control over any part of the culture–education, social agencies, welfare programs, mental health clinics, etc.

      33. Eliminate all laws or procedures which interfere with the operation of the Communist apparatus.

      34. Eliminate the House Committee on Un-American Activities.

      35. Discredit and eventually dismantle the FBI.

      36. Infiltrate and gain control of more unions.

      37. Infiltrate and gain control of big business.

      38. Transfer some of the powers of arrest from the police to social agencies. Treat all behavioral problems as psychiatric disorders which no one but psychiatrists can understand [or treat].

      39. Dominate the psychiatric profession and use mental health laws as a means of gaining coercive control over those who oppose Communist goals.

      40. Discredit the family as an institution. Encourage promiscuity and easy divorce.

      41. Emphasize the need to raise children away from the negative influence of parents. Attribute prejudices, mental blocks and retarding of children to suppressive influence of parents.

      42. Create the impression that violence and insurrection are legitimate aspects of the American tradition; that students and special-interest groups should rise up and use [“]united force[“] to solve economic, political or social problems.

      43. Overthrow all colonial governments before native populations are ready for self-government.

      44. Internationalize the Panama Canal.

      45. Repeal the Connally reservation so the United States cannot prevent the World Court from seizing jurisdiction [over domestic problems. Give the World Court jurisdiction] over nations and individuals alike.

  5. captstubby says:

    see Mithrandir ,
    this kind of logic
    is why The Party has a political commissar ,
    for the political education (ideology) and organization, and loyalty to the government… guarding it against anti-Revolutionary thought and action,

    re education camp for you.

  6. captstubby says:

    “Mission Accomplished”

  7. canary says:

    So, when are we going to help Kenya go after Al-Qaeda who kill little children in a shopping mall.

    Guess, Kenya that handles hostage situations a little different than most countries can handle the Islamic terrorists themselves by not wasting any time and entering with a blast.
    A bit stunned at quick action, and have to wonder why they haven’t just droned that faction as they did it’s former leader.

    Sharp contrast to our US leaders who would not even allow US trained Security and Special Ops go in and save the US Ambassador and US Diplomat even though it was clear it was never a hostage situation. Some say it was meant to be, though so Hillary could then release some terrorists in return for the Americans.

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